Tuesday, July 12, 2011

Occult Symbolism

“Symbols are very important. If you don’t think so, put a swastika on your arm, walk into a synagogue, and see the kind of response you get. Symbols elicit and bring out emotional responses in people. Even more importantly, symbols have their own spiritual presence. They tell you things.” -Jordan Maxwell, Ancient Symbols and Hidden Meanings Lecture

“Some of the techniques that they use in this psychic dictatorship are words, symbols, colors, rhythms, light, movement, and mudras (which mean hand-positions, gestures) which have been used for aeons as means of spiritualization, used by cults, infused with mysticism, are now being used on us for quite an opposite agenda: to drag us down into the pits of our own miasma, our own hells.” -Michael Tsarion, “The Subversive Use of Sacred Symbolism in the Media” Lecture at Conspiracy Con 2003

The bloodlines and the secret society network have their own secret language which is hidden in plain sight. Unlike our left-brained, alphabetical languages like English, Spanish, or French, the Brotherhood language is right-brained and pictographic like Egyptian Hieroglyphs or other ancient written languages; it is composed entirely of symbols. The esoteric meanings of these symbols are taught incrementally as secret society initiates climb the ranks, all the while displaying broad, benevolent, and usually false meanings to the uninitiated.

“The use of symbols to convey meaning to the initiated and to conceal it from the uninitiated is as old as civilization. A clear understanding of the symbolic way of thinking is necessary if you are to unveil and comprehend the "esoteric" (hidden or secret) meaning of the symbols of ancient and modern times.” -Jack Benjamin's introduction to “Symbols, Sex and the Stars”

“The Illuminati use what I call reverse symbolism. They place their symbols all around us but present them with the reverse of their true meaning. For example, the dove symbolizes peace to most people, but to the Illuminati bloodlines it represents their goddess, Queen Semiramis [Isis]. The lighted torch means freedom and liberty to the population, but to the Illuminati it is the very symbol of their agenda and control. The Nazis reversed the ancient symbol of the swastika to symbolize the negative and Satanists have reversed the pentagram to point downwards for the same reason. Everything is symbolism and ritual to the Illuminati, and always has been.” -David Icke, “Alice in Wonderland and the World Trade Center”


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40 comments:

Anonymous said...

Yes, symbols are all around us. An example I watched an advert of Rosetta Stone on TV and could see something interesting symbols at the end of it. Could find the advert on Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnLgZMwxqH4

When you watch it 1st time, you may not find anything, but pause the video on exactly 0:56 (it's quite tricky to do so) and you will see this:

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-
images/98/rosettastonew.jpg/

Anonymous said...

Eric Are you a God believer?

Eric Dubay said...

Nice find Anonymous. I get asked the God question a lot. I think my position on that will be cleared up when my new book comes out. I'm currently finishing up my 3rd book called Spiritual Science, which covers subjects from Quantum Physics, Consciousness, and the Holographic Universe, to Energy Healing, Reincarnation, and Near-Death Experiences. Here's a short passage from the Consciousness chapter to help answer your question:

The ancient Sufi teaching states that “God sleeps in the rock, dreams in the plant, stirs in the animal, and awakens in the man.” What if we replaced the word “God” with “The One Infinite Consciousness?” If God is defined as - an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent intelligence – then God must exist inside all things, yet outside of all space, time, and matter. What has quantum physics (and honest introspection) shown exists inside all things, yet outside space, time, and matter? Consciousness.

“Without consciousness, there would be nothing to experience form. It could also be said that form itself, as a product of perception with no independent existence, is thus transitory and limited, whereas consciousness is all-encompassing and unlimited. How could that which is transitory (with a clear beginning and ending), create that which is formless (all encompassing and omnipotent)?” -David R. Hawkins, M.D., Ph.D., “Power Vs. Force”(250-1)

How can non-experiencing, unintelligent, insentient matter randomly coalesce into a form that magically creates conscious intelligent life? What mechanical process could possibly bring consciousness, intelligence, and life into being? How could any material process create something as immaterial as consciousness? Why would the material universe even exist without a consciousness to perceive it? Quantum physics and Eastern Mysticism are both quite clear that matter does not exist without a consciousness to perceive it. Albert Einstein himself said, “A human being is a part of the whole, called by us ‘Universe’ – a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest – a kind of optical delusion of consciousness.”

“Whatever our beliefs – irrespective of how far we expand our perception and regardless of how profound the ability of science may be to understand processes of emergence – sooner or later we arrive at the requirement for an originating creative act. We arrive ultimately at the concept of a cosmic mind. Although science has so far chosen to ignore this inescapable logic, the deeper we delve into the fundamental mysteries of Nature – as did Einstein – we see order, harmony, and cosmic mind manifest in our universe. What is revealed doesn’t require us to choose between intelligent design and evolution, but to recognize a co-creative design for evolution. What we see, literally hidden in full view, is Einstein’s concept of a cosmic mind at work.” -Ervin Laszlo and Jude Currivan, “Cosmos” (22)

Eric Dubay said...

Unless you actually think “God” is a bearded white man living in the clouds, perhaps replacing that word, as Einstein did, with something like “Cosmic Mind,” “Universal Being,” or “Infinite Consciousness” will help bridge the mental gap most Westerners seem to have between science and spirituality.

“After I shook the dust of organized religion from my sandals, I learned that the link between big ‘ol God and little ‘ol me was no more and no less than consciousness. And each of us, at and as the very center of us, have this same feeling of I Am, for the not-so-obvious reason that each one of us is really God pretending to be each one of us. There is only one I Am, there is only one God, one Brahma, one Tao, one beingness … we both see the same world, because we both are the same world. But we have so cleverly and convincingly hidden ourselves from ourselves that we really believe that we are separate entities.” -Roger Stephens, “A Dangerous Book” (56)

“The coming scientific revolution heralds the end of dualism in every sense. Far from destroying God, science for the first time is proving His existence – by demonstrating that a higher, collective consciousness is out there.” -Lynne McTaggart, “The Field: The Quest for the Secret Force of the Universe,” (226)


As shown previously, the plenum of physical forms in the universe is fundamentally an energetic Oneness with consciousness playing the role of creator and experiencer. This means the multitude of transitory material forms and bodies about us, don’t exist without us, and come from within us.

“A growing body of research suggests that we’re more than cosmic latecomers simply passing through a universe that was completed long ago. Experimental evidence is leading to a conclusion that we’re actually creating the universe as we go and adding to what already exists! In other words, we appear to be the very energy that’s forming the cosmos, as well as the beings who experience what we’re creating. That’s because we are consciousness, and consciousness appears to be the same ‘stuff’ from which the universe is made.” -Gregg Braden, “The Divine Matrix” (39)

“The universe holds its breath as we choose, instant by instant, which pathway to follow; for the universe, the very essence of life itself, is highly conscious. Every act, thought, and choice adds to a permanent mosaic; our decisions ripple through the universe of consciousness to affect the lives of all. Lest this idea be considered either merely mystical or fanciful, let’s remember that fundamental tenet of the new theoretical physics: Everything in the universe is connected with everything else.” -David R. Hawkins, M.D., Ph.D., “Power Vs. Force” (148)

Anonymous said...

Hi Eric, thanks for the excerpts from your new book.
To be honest I have been disappointed with you finding some of the analysis of some other authors worth adding to your book. Especially the ones who try to prove the One conciousness which ultimately means:
1) there is no good or bad;
2) we are all Gods.

First one is an attempt by powers that be, who are controlled by Lucifer, not to be judged and opposed no matter what they do.

2nd one is the ultimate dream of Lucifer. If we all believe this BS, he/she will AT LEAST have deceived us away from God and will have some company in Hell!

One more point: if we are to believe that we are Gods, what is the difference between us and the Lucifer?

He/she has already been judged to burn in Hell forever, but have been given time so that we can be tested. God says (at least in Quran) that it is easy for Him destroy us and bring another generation of people as He has done before. If we get destroyed believing that we are Gods, why do you think we won't be judged to burn in Hell forever, and maybe be given some time to test the generation of people after us just like Lucifer and his/her demons?!

I am not against science, I actually believe it is the best way to reach God (not only for yourself, but also everybody else). But never forget that scientists (not science!) so far have led us away from God rather than to Him irrespective of the enough scientific evolution to prove that universe has a Creator.

And this is not coincidental, rather on purpose. In even small issues independent scientists (there have been so few of them) have usually come to different conclusions from the gigantic army of controlled scientists. If that's correct, you shouldn't be surprised if the "powers that be" who finance the controlled scientists have always made sure they come to unanimous conclusions about the most important topic: where the universe came from?

Eric Dubay said...

The message of our ultimate divinity has been corrupted and co-opted and thus is received with due skepticism. The phony new age/luciferian evolve your consciousness until you become a god thing is indeed a trap. But it's a convincing trap because the root is correct. I didn't say there is no good and evil, nor did I say that we are all gods. However, by definition, if "God" (an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent being) exists, then we are all a part of It.

As I wrote in Asbestos Head:

Either God is causal, singular and separate - an outside entity somehow responsible for His own existence, the creation of the universe, and the creation of other beings to recognize Him, or existence is non-causal, plural, parts and whole of all that is with nothing outside Us because We’re all infinite self-reflexive pieces of God interacting, changing, acting out eternity.

Many people are happy to accept the notion that God is some external entity like a bearded white man in the clouds that created us and watches over the universe like a fishbowl. Others are happy to accept that there is no God and the universe, consciousness, life, matter, space and time are all the result of a spontaneous big bang cosmic accident. Neither of these ideas resonate with me at all...

Here's a parable, an analogy, which comes from India, from the Upanishads, and is thousands of years old. It presents a parabolic answer to the root question of all religion and philosophy (Who am I and what is this?), and does so in a way which everyone can relate to. In the beginning of the world (and though it probably had no ultimate "beginning" as we think of them, you have to start somewhere), there was only Brahma. Being all there was, and therefore totally known to himself, Brahma soon realized that this totality of awareness would eventually become extremely boring . . . after all, when you know everything there is to know, then there's no surprise, nothing to keep you interested. It's like reading the same book for the seventy-eight millionth time. Anyway, since he was omnipotent (all-powerful), omniscient (all-knowing), and omnipresent (all-everywhere), Brahma decided to create a diversion for himself, a way of introducing the elements of surprise, intrigue and drama into his experience. He thought, "What would it be like to forget who I really am?" So, he invented the game of cosmic hide-and-seek. According to the rules of this game, Brahma would pretend to break pieces of himself off from the whole so that to all appearances they would seem separate. That's the "hide" part. Then, as the apparently separate consciousness at the center of each of those apparently separate pieces, and through their apparently separate and unique perspectives, he would "seek" to rediscover who he really was, which was, of course, everything. Imagine seeing yourself from an infinite number of different perspectives, each one initially ignorant of its relationship to all the rest. Imagine going to sleep and dreaming a different lifetime each night, each lasting for more or less years, each complete with the full range and variety of emotional life and death details. Imagine having the same dream but playing a different role in it each night, seeing it through different eyes each time. Well, guess who those apparently separate pieces are? Since there is only one I Am in the universe, one consciousness, it's all a game of hide-and-seek, and each one of us is in the same state: I'm IT AND You're IT! -Roger Stephens, "A Dangerous Book" 22-23)

Eric Dubay said...

Brahma, Tao, God, the One Infinite Consciousness, Cosmic Mind, whatever you want to call it, by definition is everything, exists everywhere, and knows everything. If that is your reality, then what do you do with your existence!? I'll tell you what I would do. I would divide myself into subjective packets of consciousness and enter them into a space/time/material world of duality where I/We could experience and create all the potential polarities possible... good and evil, male and female, black and white, inhale and exhale, sun and moon, light and dark, etc.

This world of duality would serve as a "Universe-ity" for Us/God to learn, grow, create, and experience the heights and depths of polarity consciousness. Ultimately we never separate from God, Brahma, or the one consciousness... it is only our illusion (Maya) that prevents us from seeing that we are all One.

When you're dreaming at night you create entire environments, situations, other people, have conversations with them etc. but when you wake up from the dream you realize that all those environments, situations, and other people were all you! They only seemed separate because of the level of consciousness you were operating on at the time. It is the same in this world, where you think you are a separate person, but in fact when you die, a piece of God wakes up to realize He was only dreaming.

Anonymous said...

You have to be quite easy to fool to believe in the the laughable reason for God to separate Himself into infinite number of living things each having no omnipotence, no omniscience, and no omnipresence just because of boredom and seek of game-play.

Gregg Braden who you included in your book says:
Experimental evidence is leading to a conclusion that we’re actually creating the universe as we go and adding to what already exists! In other words, we appear to be the very energy that’s forming the cosmos, as well as the beings who experience what we’re creating.

You say:
I/We could experience and create all the potential polarities possible

Let me ask a very simple question: Do you work out yourself everything what happens to you OR does is just happen?

If it the latter, please leave searching for "Godness" in you alone - you don't really need to find/see God now, leave it till after you die. If your research on this topic is leading you on this direction, it is a good idea to stop and just concentrate on being a perfect man (just like babies - no bad intentions, thoughts, actions including earning only just income). Admit it's difficult enough no matter where you live!

May God keep us in the right direction!

Eric Dubay said...

At the implicate "Brahma" objective level of reality, outside of space/time/matter, is an infinite ocean of consciousness. At the explicate "atman" subjective level of reality, each of us is like a whirlpool in the infinite ocean. Our subjective awareness, like a whirlpool, is distinct and seemingly separate, but upon closer examination we can see that there is no definite place where the ocean ends and your whirlpool begins.

You have to be quite easy to fool to believe in the the laughable reason for God to separate Himself into infinite number of living things each having no omnipotence, no omniscience, and no omnipresence just because of boredom and seek of game-play.

You're welcome to call me a fool, but you offer no reason why, and just call it laughable. I too find your casual dismissal of this beautiful and ancient Upanishads parable quite foolish.

Let me ask a very simple question: Do you work out yourself everything what happens to you OR does is just happen?

So you laugh off my entire explanation of God, and want to change the topic to Free Will vs. Determinism? My answer to that question isn't cut and dry either... you're trying to put me in a box. Here's another outside the box quote from Asbestos Head to answer your question and keep you on your toes:

From vacuum fluctuations in Andromeda to his decision between boxers and briefs, the moment to moment actualization of reality is based on each previous moment’s accruement of the entire Universe’s stream of complex probabilities. This stream is so contingent and necessarily incessant that it cannot be stopped even hypothetically without changing variables. Therefore on a large enough scale, he’s a dancer choreographed beyond his capacity to comprehend. But on a scale meaningful to him, he’ll always have the free will to flip a coin with any action, opinion, or decision.

And your last part:

If it the latter, please leave searching for "Godness" in you alone - you don't really need to find/see God now, leave it till after you die. If your research on this topic is leading you on this direction, it is a good idea to stop and just concentrate on being a perfect man (just like babies - no bad intentions, thoughts, actions including earning only just income). Admit it's difficult enough no matter where you live!

You seem pretty threatened by your own divinity! "Please leave searching for Godness in you alone - you don't really need to find/see God now, leave it till after you die." There is nothing to "search" for, but what is it you find so threatening about the notion that we are all method actors in God's dream? I am indeed doing the best I can to be a good man, to do the right thing, to be open-minded, compassionate, and 100% honest to everyone all the time. Are you trying to say that being a good man and dabbling in metaphysics are mutually exclusive?

Druv said...

" Especially the ones who try to prove the One consciousness which ultimately means:
1) there is no good or bad;
2) we are all Gods.

First one is an attempt by powers that be, who are controlled by Lucifer, not to be judged and opposed no matter what they do.

2nd one is the ultimate dream of Lucifer. If we all believe this BS, he/she will AT LEAST have deceived us away from God and will have some company in Hell!

One more point: if we are to believe that we are Gods, what is the difference between us and the Lucifer? "


This is the Christian perceptive, original "Vatican Christianity" was made as a weapon of war, eliminating pagans, and assimilating them as their own.

"Convert them and they wont fight you and work for you" is the key of the basic philosophy which is reflected in the war strategy game of "Age of empires" where monks are used to convert enemies to work for the other side. Hence it has no real merit.

Both good and evil originates from the source, i.e God. If you actually understand the quantum nature of the double slit experiment, then you will understand it.

Sanatan Dharma goes with the flow of the universe, and the "exclusive Religions" against.

Hence the "Fate" of "exclusive religions" is set. Their time will come to an end due to the destruction they have caused in the world.

History is proof enough.

Druv said...

"Brahma" was created by God Vishnu, hence "Brahma" is the overseer of the universe. He is the one that creates both good and evil.

There is only 1 temple of "Brahma" in India because his power keeps us bound to the material world.

I can talk a lot bout it, but i do not have the time.

These forces are the creative forces of the universe which are perfectly defined in Sanatan Dharma.

"Exclusive Religions" have no such details.

Anonymous said...

You will find more shills (aka the above "Anonymous") as you reveal the truth.

It's getting too hot for them to handle!

Anonymous said...

This whole God/Lucifer argument is sounding more and more complex...why would, "god" create duality, does not that imply that Lucifer/Satan or whatever devil you imagine is also the creation of this, "god?"

Why create duality if the rsult is utter confusion for the creation of this, "God?"

And who decided that this God/god - it,whatever you want to call it, has authority over us, and is in everything?

Something tells me when you mix science and religion you just some serious nonsense going...like, confusing God with his/sher/it's crappy creation of a universe that is largely corrupted and co-opted by his imaginary alter-ego...Lucifer???

Who are these intellectuals trying to kid???

Anonymous said...

You're welcome to call me a fool

I didn't call you a fool, just said you must be easy to fool. There is huge difference between the two.

So you laugh off my entire explanation of God, and want to change the topic to Free Will vs. Determinism?

Isn't it laughable to try to explain God before explaining who you are? My question about whether you work out everything what happens to you as a human being OR everything happens by itself was not about Freewill or Determinism. You didn't understand my point. Answering the conclusion I make separate from the question proved that. We don't work out ourselves what happens to us in every day life, IT JUST HAPPENS. If it's so, how do you explain me the false notion that we are the actual creators of the universe and the universe expands with whatever we do?

entire Universe’s stream of complex probabilities

I haven't read your book, but the quote above suggests you still believe in a probability theory. No, the fact that you can't understand how the universe works doesn't mean it's based on "complex probabilities". It just means that you (including everyone else) haven't been able to explain the SYSTEM behind it. Without a system the universe wouldn't survive a second. The "complex probabilities" would destroy it straight away.

The excerpt from your book suggests you don't use enough logical reasoning in your research (most of us don't do) so that you can be confident about the conclusions you make. thanks God before delving into deeper science at a boarding school we were taught Logic. It gives you all the tools to comprehend science and make absolute correct conclusions. In life it's not always possible to make 1absolute correct conclusions all the time, but use of logic helps to make more meaningful conclusions than you could otherwise.

I'm not saying what you wrote is incorrect (even though it looks so), but I don't see any logical interdependence between your statements which should link them in order to come to your final conclusion.

You seem pretty threatened by your own divinity!

You missed my point again (because you missed my point earlier). How can I be threatened for just being a human?

we are all method actors in God's dream?

Did you come to this conclusion using the reasoning method you used above? I suggested you give yourself some break because from my point of view you are making a conclusion about the fundamental issue: the origin of life. This conclusion will affect whatever you think and do, which in effect is the basis on which we are going to be judged. Sorry, I forgot that you think you are going to be awaken as a part of God after you die and realise whatever you did in your life was just a game-play...

I am indeed doing the best I can to be a good man, to do the right thing, to be open-minded, compassionate, and 100% honest to everyone all the time.

What's the point of being a good man if you think your actually a part of God and are playing a seek-and-hide game? Why don't you go and live like Satan? What is stopping you to do so if you really believe that you are not going to be judged on?

We are all born with God-given attributes that makes us like peace and justice. Most of us still keep those attributes till we die even though what satanic lives we live through. That's because it's in our DNA!

Are you trying to say that being a good man and dabbling in metaphysics are mutually exclusive?

They might be depending on what entails being a good man. Don't forget, Licifer was one of the best of the generation of people before us (including intellectually), but it didn't stop him/her to disobey God when God created us (new generation of people different from the previous) and asked him/her to bow to us. His high intellect caused him to rebel against his/her creator.

Anonymous said...

Druv said...

Both good and evil originates from the source, i.e God. If you actually understand the quantum nature of the double slit experiment, then you will understand it.

You have been asked previously to explain how your double slit experiment proves the origin of life. You have so far opted not to do so (I am sure you actually can not.. ) Please leave alone the experiments someone else has done and claims to have come to a conclusion if you can't understand/explain it.

I'm sure you will rather attack me than explain yourself..

Anonymous said...

The reason why the so-called Upinishad's parable is laughable is because it does not make any sense whatsoever.

God must have been a fool to think he/she/it can divide itself into a million or a trillion little things that are weak and fragile and that can be manipulatd.

While, "god" may be, "everywhere" there is no reason for us to worship or revere this mysterious deity. Just looking around you at the world he made...and the people he put in charge to run our sincere lives is proof that God is largely incompetent, greedy, sadistic, and has a dual-personality that is as messed up as any psychotic murderer.

Anonymous said...

Another cause of concern for Eric's constant confusion about God-Lucifer, or whatever is that he is too focused on the, "aesthetics" of it all, and forgets to make any sense of all these contradictory and largely non-sensical debacle about a god or gods who are largely incompetent in the work they are supposed to do.

Personally, Eric's conception of God seems to be a mixture of a lot of voodoo and kabbalistic deception...which is recipe for disaster...and shock, and inevitable enslavement to these highly intellecutal/religious ideas...trying to rationalize the existence of a deity who does not exist nor gives a care about anything even if it did exist is about as futile as imagining to sky to be green.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
While, "god" may be, "everywhere" there is no reason for us to worship or revere this mysterious deity. Just looking around you at the world he made...and the people he put in charge to run our sincere lives is proof that God is largely incompetent, greedy, sadistic, and has a dual-personality that is as messed up as any psychotic murderer.

What's the point of creating us with free will, if God alone is responsible for everything what happens in this world? What's stopping you to go out and fight for justice every day rather than sitting at home and complain about God? At the end of the day, the number of people who are largely responsible for all the hell in this world (powers that be) is so small compared to the people they control?

Eric Dubay said...

This whole God/Lucifer argument is sounding more and more complex...why would, "god" create duality, does not that imply that Lucifer/Satan or whatever devil you imagine is also the creation of this, "god?"

The way I see it, God, Brahma, Tao, Void, whatever you call the original creative force, was One, completely known to itself. Existence as an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent consciousness sounds great, but what do you do with your existence if you are everything, know everything, and are everywhere?

As I said, I would create a world of duality, the world of duality we clearly exist on here in this plane where subjective bits of "I Am" consciousness can experience the heights and depths of polarity, which includes good/evil, male/female, light/dark, hot/cold, happy/sad etc.

Lucifer was apparently God's favorite angel until the fall. I see that as the black on the yin yang... Satan is completely antithetical to everything God is, but he is in fact a creation of God. He's God's favorite creation because he allows for the yin to have yang, he allows for evil, so that God's goodness may be experienced while He's in seeming absence.

If it's so, how do you explain me the false notion that we are the actual creators of the universe and the universe expands with whatever we do?

I see that every moment I have the free will to go left or right, choose this or that, flip a coin or roll a die. At the same time though, I don't have the free will to flap my arms and fly to the moon. Certain aspects of experience (such as those we call physics/laws) are more or less set in stone, while other aspects are completely flimsy and malleable. I just don't see the problem of Free Will vs. Determinism as cut and dry as you do.

What's the point of being a good man if you think your actually a part of God and are playing a seek-and-hide game? Why don't you go and live like Satan? What is stopping you to do so if you really believe that you are not going to be judged on?

I didn't say we will or won't be judged, you're putting words in my mouth. You're also jumping to conclusions that by entertaining this creation myth, suddenly it destroys all ethics and should make everyone want to "go and live like satan."

Anonymous said...

My point was: what is the difference between you and a famous Hollywood actress who spends most of her time looking after herself?

You think you are actually a part of God.

She also think she must be God, because all the tabloids, TV, other media calls her so...

Eric Dubay said...

"The way I see it, people have created languages, religions, sciences, and mathematics in an attempt to discover a method that can both find Objective Truth and make it undeniably so to all subjective interpreters. The catch is Our subjectivity allows for skepticism even in the face of Absolute Truth. If God comes to me and tells me all the ultimate answers, I may still choose to disbelieve what He says or that He’s even God. The only way He could prove it is to make me omniscient like Him so I’m unable to disbelieve Truth - But in creating another omniscient being separate from Himself, God’s own omniscience is compromised, and Objective Truth rears its subjective limitations. Thus if We’re separate from God in any way, everything He stands for is a useless thought-experiment." -Asbestos Head

Druv said...

You need to read history which the exclusive religions have warped for over 2000 years . If you can cross that barrier, and find true origins, then you "might" have a chance to understand what i am talking about.

Anonymous said...

Why would God's omniscience be compromised by the existence of another omniscient being?

There is an inherent contradiction in the idea of two omnipotent beings, but I don't see one in the idea of two omniscient beings.

Eric Dubay said...

There is an inherent contradiction in having two "omni-anything" beings. By spliting itself into two separate entities, "God" can no longer claim omniscience, unless the second being isn't actually omniscient or isn't actually separate.

Anonymous said...

I don't see how you are reaching that conclusion. Knowledge is not exclusive in the same way that power is exclusive. Power, in the sense of omnipotence, requires that you have power over another entity, which of course creates a paradox if you try supposing two omnipotent beings.

Knowledge is not exclusive in this way; it is not necessary for everyone else to be stupid in order for me to be smart. God's omniscience would not be diminished by another's knowledge in the same way that His omnipotence would be diminished by another's power.

Power is relative. Knowledge is not.

Eric Dubay said...

It's the inherent limitation of a subjective standpoint. You cannot have two objective or omniscient beings. Objectivity and omniscience imply Oneness, and subjectivity implies separateness. If there exist "two" all-knowing beings (and all-knowing must by definition include knowing even the other's "subjective standpoint"), then how can you call them two/separate? They would simply be one omniscient being pretending it was two... Which is in essence what the Upanishads parable refers to.

Anonymous said...

Let me see if I understand you:

Are you saying that if two entities have the exact same knowledge (which is implicit in the concept of two omniscient entities), those two entities must in fact be the same entity? That it is impossible to fully understand and know an entity without becoming (or being to begin with) one with that entity?

Anonymous said...

Eric, you seem to be confused and confusing others with your conclusions made using illogical reasoning methods.

I suggest you and enyone else to learn Logic (not Science of Logic) before delving into understanding anything, especially science. Logic may be much different and difficult to excel than you might have thought (when I learnt it at school, I found it extremely challenging):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logic

It's a great shame it is not taught in every school even though almost all schools teach science...

Eric Dubay said...

I have a degree in Philosophy and took more than one course in Formal Logic. I'm quite familiar with it and enjoy studying it, however, you seem to have fallen into the Left-Brain Prisoner trap of thinking that logic can magically find Absolute Truth and make it undeniably so to all subjective interpreters. This is what I was referring to in the Asbestos Head quote above. Science, Math, and Logic are all Left-Brain analytical methods that people foolishly place 100% trust in, only to find that no such system is foolproof.

For instance, if something is not repeatable or measurable, then the scientific method is useless (i.e. you can't use science to explain synchronicities)

In Asbestos Head chapter 3, I show how mathematics is the same. People put 100% trust in the "logic" of numbers only to ultimately admit defeat when they come up against so called "irrational numbers," prime calculations, "assumed infinities," etc.

I have been privy to many mystical (right-brained) experiences and have felt/experienced in my consciousness truths deeper than Science, Math, Logic or Language could ever touch.

Are you saying that if two entities have the exact same knowledge (which is implicit in the concept of two omniscient entities), those two entities must in fact be the same entity? That it is impossible to fully understand and know an entity without becoming (or being to begin with) one with that entity?

Yes. To claim independence as two separate entities, they must therefore have their own unique, subjective standpoints. If both entities are omniscient, then that includes knowing and being able to experience the other entity's subjective viewpoint. But if both entities can fully know and experience each other, then there is no subjectivity. And if there is no subjectivity, then they are actually the same One objective entity pretending to be two.

Eric Dubay said...

To put it more amusingly, God has a universal case of "multiple personality disorder" or "disassociative identity disorder," and none of the personalities are aware that they're all emanations of one source.

Anonymous said...

Synchronicity is the experience of two or more events, that are apparently causally unrelated or unlikely to occur together by chance, that are observed to occur together in a meaningful manner. (from Wikipedia)

Those words in bold mean those event can be related, and can be occurring by chance, and meaningful is a subjective attribute, rather than objective.

I don't deny that this kind of events may happen, but even if they do it doesn't mean science can not explain it. It only means we haven't developed science enough to measure/explain it.

Be in no doubt that mathematics can measure, thus explain everything. If we can't measure/explain something using the mathematics as we know it doesn't mean mathematics can't either.

All your mystical left-brained experiences can be measured and explained using science, provided we have developed enough in science.

Eric Dubay said...

I don't deny that this kind of events may happen, but even if they do it doesn't mean science can not explain it. It only means we haven't developed science enough to measure/explain it.

It's all a carrot on a stick, but good luck thinking science will someday explain everything.

Be in no doubt that mathematics can measure, thus explain everything. If we can't measure/explain something using the mathematics as we know it doesn't mean mathematics can't either.

You say science and math can explain everything. That's where we fundamentally disagree. There are truths to our reality that are beyond the rational mind to comprehend. No matter how evolved science, mathematics, or any other discipline or language become, they will not be able to find a method of determining Absolute Truth and making it undeniably so to all subjective interpreters. The Absolute, God, Brahma, the Oneness state IS the Objective Truth and it is absolutely unattainable and unexplainable to rational subjective minds. Science, Math, nor Logic will ever prove this, it is up to you.

All your mystical left-brained experiences can be measured and explained using science, provided we have developed enough in science.

Good luck waiting for that too. Peace

Druv said...

I have said before Modern Science is the warped version of the older one.

God and Aether was taken out by the Illuminati, when Vatican Church was not able to prove the existence of God.

The West is not the true original source of Science, nor the concept of God.

Look up the video of "Universal Resonance" on youtube, at 5 minutes you will see that God and Aether used to exist in Science.

When these concepts were removed from the "Original" science, the so -called modern Science gave birth to the destructive "Industrialization" that is destroying the world.

Illuminati now controls and hides behind Vatican, and controls the whole Christian people by manipulating information.

Druv said...

I am here to reveal their darkness, so all of the people of the world will be free from their dark entanglement.

If you dislike what i say, feel free to challenge me.

I enjoy a real challenge! =)

Druv said...

To put it more amusingly, God has a universal case of "multiple personality disorder" or "disassociative identity disorder," and none of the personalities are aware that they're all emanations of one source.

Nice ! can you see the recurring wave effect yet?

Sahil said...

I think we are living in a holographic universe, people of the east have called it Maya i.e. illusion. This holographic universe is the creation of consciousness. As long as people continue to seek fulfillment from anything in this illusion (including imaginary gods of organized religions) they will remain trapped and keep reincarnating here and experience the various polarities.

we all are connected to the one consciousness but we are lost in our own creation, the systematic destruction of ancient knowledge and traditions; to some extent has severed our connection with the source.

Anonymous said...

Here is Oda - and: grrr, now I try for the 2nd time to post a comment...
That "Anonymous" god-believer should educate him-/herself. To BELIEVE (what's that btw ???) that some space-commanders (elohim = plural) thousands of years ago (up to17.000 years ore even more...) would be watching over each and every persons life today is simply hilarious! The only ones controlling us are Google and the like... surveillance-cameras in the streets and Your VISA-Card etc. No gods there - we only trade our freedom for convenience...
I guess aome people dont want to grow up and need a big daddy until they die. That's what the religions provide for. I am a woman - and I have been suspicious of those exclusive boys-clubs from the beginning. God=male, angels=male, kings in the bible=male,prophets=male,savior=male... BIG GRIN...
For the real story start with Wayne Herschel's "The Hidden Records" (YouTube-channel wayhersc , website thehiddenrecords.com)
Or watch "The Mars-Earth Connection: Cydonia in Ancient Science and Mythology" by David E. Flynn on YouTube. He wrote some books,too: "Cydonia: The Secret Chronicles of Mars", "Temple At The Center Of Time: Newton's Bible Codex Finally Deciphered and the Year 2012" ... and he runs the Watcher Website www.mt.net/~watcher/ plus forum (the guy is a christian ;-) or: read Richard Hoagland's "The Monuments of Mars: A City on the Edge of Forever" website www.enterprisemission.com/

All the egyptians had were poor remains of stories of incidents that happened even ages before the egytian high civilization.

Wake up, grow up, respect those who respect life - and respect Yourself!

Greetings from Germany ;-)

Laurel said...

Fascinating conversation! I resonate strongly with your views on God and science, Eric. Science is indeed useful and interesting, yet limited. I agree that everything is a part of God, and that doesn't mean that we "are" gods ourselves, or any of that New Age crap.

jon said...

Personally I'm with you Eric, God is nature. Nature is creation, nature is destruction. There is no such thing as unnatural except the word itself. We don't need an external, seperate place called hell or heaven. Nature/we create harmony and sow destruction right on our own doorstep every second of every day. Accusing angels dark or pure is our own weakness in not taking responsability for our own actions. There is a beautiful poem by T.S Elliot about how we strive to find God in every place and manner we can think off and only end up further away. Like you say...God is inside us...we
are all God. Every atom every quark every particle...all God. And with its duality,(or good and evil) , completely necessary for existance.

Gary N. said...

So many symbols on this planet and so many people that do not understand the real meaning of them yet still flash them blindly.